Josh Brolin Is Freakier Than Ever
This story contains spoilers from season 2 of Outer Range.
âIâm going to tell you this: Itâs a name-dropping moment,â says Josh Brolin, whoâZooming in from his kitchen, wearing a navy T-shirt and a camo hatâis absolutely not a name-dropping type of guy. But he has to tell me this story. âI got a call from Warren Beatty one day. He was like, âHey, do you want to have lunch?â â
Iâm talking to Brolin on the occasion of Outer Rangeâs big, bold, and existentially terrifying return. The Prime Video sci-fi western series, now in its second season, stars Brolin as Royal Abbott, a rancher in Wyoming who discovers a mysterious hole on his property. Turns out if anyone just so happens to dive into this particular hole, they travel through time. Time-hopping tales are back in vogue, but you wonât find another one quite like Outer Range. Its mysteries elicit Lost-esque fan speculation, the cast (which also includes Imogen Poots and Tom Pelphrey) is stellar, and Brolinâs portrayal of Abbott is a masterful deconstruction of fading masculine ideals. If youâre here simply to hear from Brolin, thank youâbut watch Outer Range when youâre done.
Back to the story. Brolin went to lunch with Warren Beatty, because when Warren Beatty asks you to lunch, you go. âI figured it was a project that he was working on,â Brolin continues. âBy the second hour, Iâm like, âSo, whatâs up?â He was like, âWhat do you mean? I just wanted to talk to you.â â Brolin was floored. âI was like, âWhat a funny thing.â â
So they kept talking. Then Beatty said something that would stick with Brolinâand maybe even chart the course of his nascent third act, which is already feeling like the most electric of his career. âHe was staring at me, and I go, âWhy are you staring at me like that?â He goes, âHave you directed before? You should start directingâ â Why? Well, it was simple. âHe said, âBecause youâre a director. Thatâs why.â â
And when Warren Beatty tells you to direct…you direct. Brolin stepped behind the camera this season for Outer Rangeâs sixth episode, which is one of its very best. Itâs trippy as all hell (even for this show); flashes slick action and a series-changing ending; and even features a Sister Christian needle drop. Itâs the kind of effort that shows that the fifty-six-year-old has learned a thing or two from the Coen brothers, the Russos, Denis Villeneuve, Gus Van Santâyou get it.
In fact, Brolin would like to do more of it. He just needs to find the time. The actorâs memoir comes out this fall; plus, heâs writing a play, moving (which always sucks, right?), parenting his two youngest children (ages three and five), managing the Internetâs best Instagram account, and doing all of the other things Josh Brolin does. Today, though, heâs nursing a coldâwhich he braved to talk about Outer Rangeâs season finale, the future of the series, and his quietly stellar SNL hosting turn. This conversation has been edited for clarity and length.
Karen Kuehn/PrimeBrolin directs the series-shifting episode 6 of Outer Range. âThere were a lot of interests that Iâve had through the decades that I never really understood,â he says. âWhen I directed, I was able to funnel it all into one place without trying to force it.â
JOSH BROLIN: Iâm warning you right now: I woke up withâit started yesterday, but really, it was this morningâa massive cold.
ESQUIRE: Oh, no.
I have children. Itâs just the way it is.
Iâm the clichĂ© man whoâs a huge baby when heâs sick.
Iâm actually the worst. I have a very, very high threshold to most pain, but when it comes to being sick, I canât stand it. When I was a kid, I got sick all the time. As I got older, it got worse and worse for some reason. My daughter Eden has it. Sheâs thirty-one. So does my daughter Chapel, whoâs three and a half. Itâs just the way our sinuses are designed.
When I was twenty-four, I literally walked off Eighty-sixth Streetâbetween Central Park West and Columbusâand I went to an ear, nose, and throat guy, Dr. David Volpi. Heâs literally my guardian angel. I walked in there, and I said, âIâm so miserable.â He looked in my sinuses and he was like, âYouâre breathing through cracks of petrified wood.â He Roto-Rootered all six of my sinus cavities. Iâll never forget waking up from the operation. He pulled out the gauze and it was like a magic trick. That first breathâI felt it travel through my entire face. It was heaven.
Itâs about the work. Just do the fucking work wherever you are.Wow. Congratulations, by the way, on the new season. Itâs really incredible.
Good, good. All the things that inspired me as a young actorâfor whatever reason, I lean toward heightened absurdity that exploits human foiblesâthis show embraces fully.
Everyone writes in headlines: âThis is sci-fi Yellowstone!â But thatâs not what it is. Itâs deeply weird. The rocks are like shrooms now!
Itâs so good. If you look at the parallel nowânot that it was on purposeâbut if you look at the ayahuasca trends right now, itâs how to break out of your own self-perpetuated prison. Especially around American lore, stoicism, arrogance, and this idea that weâre unbreakable, yet weâre so broken. At least thatâs how I like to look at itâespecially me, because [the media is always referring to me as] like âLast Man in Hollywoodâ and all this kind of shit. I go, âLetâs take that, super masculinize it, and break Royal and see what heâs really made of.â
Thereâs so much you can say about Outer Range. Even just about getting olderâthereâs Wayne Tillerson walking into the bar that he went to as a young man.
Itâs not even that you get it or you donât, but when you really get it, you get itâbecause it is multilayered. Itâs as cosmetic as you want it to be, or you can go further with it, which are the greatest stories. George Saunders just wrote a book on Russian short stories, and Iâm almost through it. It should have been the most boring book imaginable, but those were short stories that I remember reading in a shitty Los Feliz bookstore, on the concrete floor, sucking this stuff up, and going, Why is this so good? Itâs based on simplicity, but it can be as profound and existential as you want it to be.
Amazon PrimeIn season 2 of Outer Range, Royal Abbott has to atone for a lifetime of lying to his family. âThe transition between lies and truth is major,â Brolin says.
Tell me about directing episode 6.
When I first met [showrunner] Charles Murray, we just got on right away. He was like, âYouâre directing six.â I went, âOkay.â Thatâs how it happened. It wasnât like, âHey, do you trust me with directing?â Heâs like, âNo, Iâve seen the stuff that youâve done. Iâve spent enough time with you, and this is your niche.â But it was great. I prepped a lot. I wasnât lazy about it. Like writing a bookâI overprepped, and then I started shaving down and economizing.
I said this as a joke on KimmelâI was like, âI donât particularly love actors.â Especially people who wonât come to the set and that kind of shit. If thereâs a good reason, I get it, but if youâre just an irritated actor because youâre so creative or sensitive, I just donât buy it.
Itâs a miserable way to live, carrying that attitude around.
Thereâs still an idea that the homeless, Jacques PrĂ©vert writer is the good writer. No. I wanted to write my book in this little shack that was designed after Dylan Thomasâs boatâmy wife gave it to me for my birthdayâbut where did I write the book? I wrote it in bathrooms. I wrote it in Jordan. I wrote it wherever I wrote it. Itâs about the work. Just do the fucking work wherever you are.
Did directing feel good enough for you to want to do more of it?
I loved it, man. I love the design of it. I love the architecture of it. I love the celebration of it. There were a lot of interests that Iâve had through the decades that I never really understood. When I directed, I was able to funnel it all into one place without trying to force it. My whole life made sense.âŠIâm not going to quit acting and just be a director. But it utilizes more of my sensibilities as a person. Iâm naturally a communal person. I get excited by experimenting. To imprison that with just me feels really limiting. But I may just be a mediocre actor.
I wrote a play that we just did a reading of. We had Patricia Arquette come down. Sheâd never done anything like that. It was amazing, man. We really needed an audience to be able to get feedback and reactions. The talkback was amazing; I was really blown away. People got the play, but what I was most pleased about was they said, âWe didnât feel like we were being force-fed a message.â
I saw the Merrily We Roll Along revival a few weeks agoâI loved it, but that play does feel like it spoon-feeds you an existential crisis.
Totally. You get enough of that already. I remember reading the book twenty years ago I Know This Much Is True. I was just viscerally moved by it. I miss that feeling. I donât know if itâs because Iâm jaded, or Fonzie tried to jump the shark too many times, but I miss just being transported.
Amazon PrimeWhat would Brolin like to see in Outer Range season 3? âWhat if we see him with a shaved head and a shaved beard?â he muses.
Itâs the times, too. You were promoting Outer Range on Instagram and said, âDonât let the algorithm tell you what to watch.â Itâs this cultural bleed of watching and Googling and talking algorithmically.
Look, the only social media that I have is Instagram, and thereâs a way to utilize Instagram if youâre disciplined. Iâve found amazing writers that Iâve actually connected with. But if youâre just sitting there, a victim to their algorithmâwhich by the way, changesâyou can start to go, Oh, you like this? You want to see that naked chick again? I got four for you. You go, Wait a second. I still have control over this if I want to. I can still discover.
Just to switch gears, I want to make sure Iâ
You do your job.
The line we hear in the finale: âTime is a river, Royal. This is your destiny.â Whatâs your take on it?
Was it Richard Bach? He wrote Illusions, and thereâs a poem at the beginning. Itâs like, if you hold on [to the riverside], youâre going to get battered. Whereas if you just let go of these ideas of yourself, youâll flow in the water. Thatâs the whole Royal thing. The truth of the matter is that he has an idea of masculinity. What happens when you break that idea? Thatâs why I was attracted to it. Itâs something that Iâm doing constantly. My mom raised me to be a drunk, ass-kicking cowboy, and thatâs just the deal. She was a tough, tough, tough woman. Thatâs what I was being sculpted as. Mine was self-prescribed for whatever reasonâand I love it now. So there is a parallel: constantly being slapped by humility and saying, âWhatever idea that youâre coming up with about yourself? Not only is it inaccurate, but it doesnât matter in the long run.â
I canât remember anything that depicts the idea of changing yourself with more turmoil than what we see on Outer Range. Especially how hard it is to change what your upbringing may lead you toward.
This is where Royalâs head was at in the end of season 1. He said, âOkay, Iâm going to divulge everything, everybodyâs going to clap, and then weâre going to be okay again.â The transition between lies and truth is major. Itâs like people getting sober. When you get sober, it doesnât all get better, man. Donât forget your wife has been sitting there and saying, âYou have to stop. Youâre killing our family.â Well, sheâs gotten into that habit. Just because you choose to stop drinking doesnât mean that sheâs going to be able to break that habit.
Thatâs why itâs smart of Outer Range to spend all of season 2 showing how Royal has to untangle his lies. He couldâve just been okay by the end of season 2, episode 1.
Thatâs no fun. Season 3, we donât know. Charles and I have talked about it. Iâm really surprised, because initially I thought, One season and weâre good. Weâll take a big swing, and if it works, it works. If it doesnât, it doesnât. I am really into it now. I do think this season is better, more powerful, more dynamic, and itâs smarter. Season 3, thereâs some outlandish ideas, mostly from me. Charles keeps it practical, which I appreciate. But Iâm like, âWhat if we see him with a shaved head and a shaved beard?â
Thatâd be sick.
Thatâs what I’m saying. Iâm like, âWhat would that story be? Why?â Then we start coming up with ideas. I liked that there was no transition between season 1 and season 2. It just literally started where we left off, which I thought was really fun. But I donât know if that will be the case here. I know I donât want to play it safe. I do know that.
Before we go, I just have to say: You hosted the best SNL episode of the season.
Right on!
The Sandwich King.
I love the Sandwich King. They wanted to cut the Sandwich King.
It was quietly really good.
Itâs funnyâ[SNL] got better after that. I know they needed a shot of energy, and they were very sweet in telling me, âWeâve been a little static.â It was really fun. I know Lorne and I went in thereâwe didnât need each other, because it was different from the last time I hosted, in 2012. This was like, âDo you want to do it?â I go, âWell, why would I do it? Because I want to make sure that I havenât slipped into a sloth by doing too many big Dunes or Avengers, so I need the challenge.â
When we were talking about the ice-bath thingâI wonât tell you who said itâbut they were like, âItâs not funny.â And I said, âItâs not meant to be funny.â Itâs meant to be me. I said, âThatâs what I want to be able to convey here.â They said, âThe poetry thing is super creepy and doesnât totally work,â and I go, âI know. Itâs okay. Thatâs what we need to do.â
Anything I missed?
No, Iâm happy right now. Iâm happy with this time. Itâs my version of a midlife crisis, and I really like it. Iâm not buying a Porsche. Weâre moving out of L.A. Weâre directing, writing a play; we got a book coming out in November. Weâre fucking with it. Iâm tired. It doesnât matter. What matters is manifesting whatever it is I feel, and itâs been a great liberation.